Hello guys I am the proud owner of a 20 month old male IRN (blue) named Wally.
Wally is wonderful to say the least. He began talking at 6 months, gives kisses, is potty trained and a riot to have around at dinner parties etc.
About three days ago we noticed he had plucked some feathers under his Right wing. I figured he would be molting soon and thought nothing of it. The next day he was paying more attention to it, so I took a closer look. There was a once centimeter cut under the arm. It was straight and clean.. similar to a bad papercut. I cleansed it with a surgical scrub and sent him on his way.
Over the next 20 hours or so, he went ballistic and started to self mutilate. His wing/armpit were covered in blood, he ripped off enough flesh to make a quarter sized lesion on the wing webbing and the muscle was exposed. I would watch him grab his own flesh and tear off pieces like a vulture. I immediately called my avian vet yeterday AM when we woke up and he was acting abnormal.... not calling for us (a most IRNs do at the break of dawn) and refusing to come to me.
The vet asked me to bring him in immediately. We cleansed the wound again, gave antibiotic and steriod injections and he was kept in an incubator with oxygen for 24 hours. He lost almost 20 grams of body weight throughout this time.
We were able to bring him home today because he is eating, but have to watch him closely and administer medication. He is in a E-collar which he will wear for several months while the wound heals. He cannot be in his cage for fear of falling or strangulation from the collar if it gets caught on something. He will most likely have surgery in 2 weeks to debride some of the tissue to aid in recovery.
OUr avian vet is warning us that he may never fly again.
His cultures show enteritis of gram negative bacteria. We are waiting on chlamydia and giardia tests to come back. He was tested for all of this in june of 2009 (when we first got him) and was all negative.
I am devastated to say the least. I work in the medical profession, in surgery actually, and I have never seen such destruction in a short time. We dont know if it started as in injury or if the bird was in pain/discomfort from the stomach bug and it caused him to pick.
He has never been a picker, spends most of his days with us or outside his cage.
I wanted to share this with you all, and let you know how easily this can happen. Our birds are very sensitive creatures.
I will keep posting with updates! All I can say is to treat everything your bird does 'different' as a sign of something else... get it checked out.... dont even wait it out for 24 hours as things can turn catastrophic.
He ate well this evening and the wound i mostly pink with no bleeding. He is resting quietly. I have taken the next week off of work to take care of my baby. I dont want to leave him alone. I will pick up a scale tomorrow so I can report to the avian vet that he is gaining weight (hopefully!!)
Comments/Suggestions or anything else that may help us keep him happy are welcome.
Jessica and Wally.
How quickly things can go wrong!
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floridamedgirl
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How quickly things can go wrong!
"Wally" IRN Male DOH 3/8/09
Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
Wow thank you so much for this post! I'm glad that you were able to get that under control and get the proper testing done.
I am glad Wally is healing up. [hug]
I am glad Wally is healing up. [hug]
I've been called 'birdbrained' before, but somehow I don't think this is what they meant. say:hah-nay
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floridamedgirl
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Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
Wally has gained 4 grams since sunday so at least we are looking better. Ive gone through three different types of collars to find one that he tolerates most, and doesnt distract him from eating!
Giardia came back negative, but still waiting on Chlamydia...
This morning he is eating well so I have my fingers crossed!
Giardia came back negative, but still waiting on Chlamydia...
This morning he is eating well so I have my fingers crossed!
"Wally" IRN Male DOH 3/8/09
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floridamedgirl
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Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
Got a call from the vet today,
Chlamydia came back negative!
So at least all the major infectious bugs are ruled out.
Yesterday afternoon Wally took a bath and I took the collar off so he could dry, even though we watched him, he still got to his wing (sneaky little bugger) so we had a little set back.
Today I made him a new collar out of a small plastic bottle that I cut to size and wrapped with coban (vet wrap) he seems to tolerate it bettter than the last one which I made out of rolled card board (he kept eating/tearing it up).
Im not too excited to go back to work on Monday as he will be alone with the collar on. Vet says he cant go to his cage yet, but every chance Wally gets, he jumps down and runs across the house to our office (where his cage is).
I cleaned out his cage, boiled all his toys etc. Its so empty and lonely right now. I bought all new toys etc, but Im too afraid to put him in there!!
More soon....
Jess and Wally
Chlamydia came back negative!
So at least all the major infectious bugs are ruled out.
Yesterday afternoon Wally took a bath and I took the collar off so he could dry, even though we watched him, he still got to his wing (sneaky little bugger) so we had a little set back.
Today I made him a new collar out of a small plastic bottle that I cut to size and wrapped with coban (vet wrap) he seems to tolerate it bettter than the last one which I made out of rolled card board (he kept eating/tearing it up).
Im not too excited to go back to work on Monday as he will be alone with the collar on. Vet says he cant go to his cage yet, but every chance Wally gets, he jumps down and runs across the house to our office (where his cage is).
I cleaned out his cage, boiled all his toys etc. Its so empty and lonely right now. I bought all new toys etc, but Im too afraid to put him in there!!
More soon....
Jess and Wally
"Wally" IRN Male DOH 3/8/09
Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
Thanks for the update. I really hope you can find out what it is. How mysterious.
I've been called 'birdbrained' before, but somehow I don't think this is what they meant. say:hah-nay
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floridamedgirl
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- Joined: Sat May 09, 2009 7:13 pm
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Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
Wally update!
He finished his antibiotics and his 'wound' is only a third of the size, and is just on the surface. It used to be much deeper.
He has had two large scabs dry up and come off. I think after this one comes off, it will be a series of smaller scabs until its gone. It is amazing how well he is healing. We cant wait to take off his collar, even though he is used to it, you can tell he doesnt like it. He just took a shower for the first time since the injury, and theres alot of words and gestures that he hasnt done/said since the injury.
At this point, I dont see how he can need another surgery, the skin is intact, pink, and smooth. Im pretty sure all the old dead tissue came off in the first scab which was large, crusty and brown.
Ive switched from putting on a topical antibiotic (neosporin) to just using a vitamin E skin oil I bought at walgreens. His skin is much softer and the healing has accelerated since I switched to the oil. Its walgreens brand vitamin E skin oil (its just vitaman E and safflower oil). I just rub it under the arm, around the wound, and over the scab with my finger. He stands there quietly and allows me to do my job as it is now a 'routine'.
I layed off the pain meds because he was always stoned. His appetite was crappy and all he did was sleep. Since I weaned him off, he is making leaps in the right direction. He has gained about 6 grams of weight.
Even though it was TERRIBLE timing, weve been looking for a mate and somehow someone came to us with a 2 yr old lutino female that is so sweet you could hand her to your 2 year old. She doesnt speak, but clucks! she hasa started some mumbling and I feel confident that she will speak with enough interaction.
The two are interacting, but not exactly 'in love' lol. They sleep in the same cage and all, and get closer and closer to eachother every day... but no preening sessions or snuggling as of yet. It definitly wasnt our timing choice, but it has worked out well.
More updates to come as my little man recovers. No one can still say what has caused this.
I think we are leaning towards either Sexual frustration or his wing clipping during the summer....
We had his wings clipped (but they left the two longer feathers so that he could still flutter if he fell. The avian vet didnt like the clipping job (I had my normal vet - for our cats- clip the wings because our bird vet is far away... our normal vet has many many birds, and brings HIS birds to my avian vet, so I felt confident in him clipping the wings) Maybe Wally didnt like the clip? Maybe a rough edged feather was rubbing him? We didnt find anything, but Ill tell you what, Ill be looking MUCH closer next time!
Ill keep you all posted, but I would like to say we are in the home stretch, and Wally got a girlfriend out of the whole mess, so I may be posting in the breeding section next year...... uhoh!!!!
Jess
(theres a bird show 2 hours from our house this weekend..... hopefully we dont end up with another bird! Its not in the plans, and our plate is full, but either way we are looking forward to seeing the birds!)
the skin oil...
http://www.walgreens.com/store/c/walgre ... 27-product
He finished his antibiotics and his 'wound' is only a third of the size, and is just on the surface. It used to be much deeper.
He has had two large scabs dry up and come off. I think after this one comes off, it will be a series of smaller scabs until its gone. It is amazing how well he is healing. We cant wait to take off his collar, even though he is used to it, you can tell he doesnt like it. He just took a shower for the first time since the injury, and theres alot of words and gestures that he hasnt done/said since the injury.
At this point, I dont see how he can need another surgery, the skin is intact, pink, and smooth. Im pretty sure all the old dead tissue came off in the first scab which was large, crusty and brown.
Ive switched from putting on a topical antibiotic (neosporin) to just using a vitamin E skin oil I bought at walgreens. His skin is much softer and the healing has accelerated since I switched to the oil. Its walgreens brand vitamin E skin oil (its just vitaman E and safflower oil). I just rub it under the arm, around the wound, and over the scab with my finger. He stands there quietly and allows me to do my job as it is now a 'routine'.
I layed off the pain meds because he was always stoned. His appetite was crappy and all he did was sleep. Since I weaned him off, he is making leaps in the right direction. He has gained about 6 grams of weight.
Even though it was TERRIBLE timing, weve been looking for a mate and somehow someone came to us with a 2 yr old lutino female that is so sweet you could hand her to your 2 year old. She doesnt speak, but clucks! she hasa started some mumbling and I feel confident that she will speak with enough interaction.
The two are interacting, but not exactly 'in love' lol. They sleep in the same cage and all, and get closer and closer to eachother every day... but no preening sessions or snuggling as of yet. It definitly wasnt our timing choice, but it has worked out well.
More updates to come as my little man recovers. No one can still say what has caused this.
I think we are leaning towards either Sexual frustration or his wing clipping during the summer....
We had his wings clipped (but they left the two longer feathers so that he could still flutter if he fell. The avian vet didnt like the clipping job (I had my normal vet - for our cats- clip the wings because our bird vet is far away... our normal vet has many many birds, and brings HIS birds to my avian vet, so I felt confident in him clipping the wings) Maybe Wally didnt like the clip? Maybe a rough edged feather was rubbing him? We didnt find anything, but Ill tell you what, Ill be looking MUCH closer next time!
Ill keep you all posted, but I would like to say we are in the home stretch, and Wally got a girlfriend out of the whole mess, so I may be posting in the breeding section next year...... uhoh!!!!
Jess
(theres a bird show 2 hours from our house this weekend..... hopefully we dont end up with another bird! Its not in the plans, and our plate is full, but either way we are looking forward to seeing the birds!)
the skin oil...
http://www.walgreens.com/store/c/walgre ... 27-product
"Wally" IRN Male DOH 3/8/09
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floridamedgirl
- Posts: 80
- Joined: Sat May 09, 2009 7:13 pm
- Location: South Florida
- Contact:
Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
Hello all,
It has been a whjile since I posted and alot has happened!
Wally completely healed about 3 weeks ago. I left a donut shaped collar around him just to remind him to stay away from the wing. One day while i was at work about 2 weeks ago, he reached and gnawed a NEW wound into the axilla (arm pit) of the same wing. Considering the first wound was in the wing webbing, I was very concerned. I called my vet, and was told he needed "treatment" (aka another thousand bucks). I left messages and asked for a response to what kind of treatment would be offered, as I still had all the supplies from the last episode.
The vet did not return my calls.
I made an appointment with a new vet for a second opinion and requested records from my old vet. My old vet suddenly became concerned and called me repeatedly "desperate" to talk to me. Heh....
So the new vet put a new collar on him (he ate through the tube collar they originally put on him) and put him on antibiotics/antifungal (for any infection that may be caused from his mouth contaminating the wound) along with Neurontin.
We are suspecting he is feeling a nerve pain in the axilla due to the tissue damage. The Neurontin (a human drug) is actually used in patients after shingles or other nerve damaging diseases/causes to decrease the nerve impulse at the synapse level.
The new vet feels this is a good way to alleviate his discomfort while healing.
The old Vet wants to put him on an opiate instead (pain med) to not only combat the pain but also make him a little loopy so he stops wanting to go to the wing out of habit (like a person who bites their nails out of habit).
My husband and I are currently going with the neurontin as we want to see our bird eating and interacting rather than being stoned all day (as this is a long term treatment...).
We have been on the neurontin and metacam (anti inflammatory... like advil) along with the antibiotic/antifungal since saturday (five days) and we have seen a great improvement. WAlly used to look at his wing constantly and search for any opportunity to grab at it. He hasnt even noticed the collar in days....is eating more, and interacting more. (He was a little antisocial for a while..)
The vet also gave us something called Vetericyn. IF YOUR BIRD EVER HAS A WOUND I STRONGLY SUGGEST ASKING FOR THIS PRODUCT! ITS AWESOME. The wound was again very deep, into the muscle, with a large scab surrounding the outer area, looking terrible (the vet took a picture....). Today the scab is gone, it actually debrided the wound. It was a little pink and swollen yesterday, but with a closer look you could see it was granulation tissue closing the wound. I have read alot about this product and it seems that it can kill many germs including MRSA without harming the tissue and actually claims to increase oxygen level to the site applied for up to 2 days. I wouldnt believe it if I didnt try it. The wound looks like what the last one would have taken 2 weeks to get to this point. Not to mention this stuff isnt greasy and leaves no film or residue. Its safe on mucous membranes and eyes (I did research before applying to my bird). The triple antibiotic I was using (per vet instructions) was leaving residue and inhibiting his ability to fluff and stay warm. Not anymore!
We have an appointment to see the vet at the 3 weeks mark. I feel confident that the wound will be gone within a week. The question is whether or not he will still attack the wing due to nerve pain and whether or not he may have to be on the nerve medicine forever, or even the collar forever. My husband and I will love him and care for him no matter what it takes. We are hoping we can make him comfortable and happy. He is a fighter and we have our fingers crossed.
I will try and post the pic the vet took to show you the wound for reference.
We still are speculating whether or not he will fly ever again, but in the grande scheme of things, thats on the middle/bottom of the list right now.
Jessica
It has been a whjile since I posted and alot has happened!
Wally completely healed about 3 weeks ago. I left a donut shaped collar around him just to remind him to stay away from the wing. One day while i was at work about 2 weeks ago, he reached and gnawed a NEW wound into the axilla (arm pit) of the same wing. Considering the first wound was in the wing webbing, I was very concerned. I called my vet, and was told he needed "treatment" (aka another thousand bucks). I left messages and asked for a response to what kind of treatment would be offered, as I still had all the supplies from the last episode.
The vet did not return my calls.
I made an appointment with a new vet for a second opinion and requested records from my old vet. My old vet suddenly became concerned and called me repeatedly "desperate" to talk to me. Heh....
So the new vet put a new collar on him (he ate through the tube collar they originally put on him) and put him on antibiotics/antifungal (for any infection that may be caused from his mouth contaminating the wound) along with Neurontin.
We are suspecting he is feeling a nerve pain in the axilla due to the tissue damage. The Neurontin (a human drug) is actually used in patients after shingles or other nerve damaging diseases/causes to decrease the nerve impulse at the synapse level.
The new vet feels this is a good way to alleviate his discomfort while healing.
The old Vet wants to put him on an opiate instead (pain med) to not only combat the pain but also make him a little loopy so he stops wanting to go to the wing out of habit (like a person who bites their nails out of habit).
My husband and I are currently going with the neurontin as we want to see our bird eating and interacting rather than being stoned all day (as this is a long term treatment...).
We have been on the neurontin and metacam (anti inflammatory... like advil) along with the antibiotic/antifungal since saturday (five days) and we have seen a great improvement. WAlly used to look at his wing constantly and search for any opportunity to grab at it. He hasnt even noticed the collar in days....is eating more, and interacting more. (He was a little antisocial for a while..)
The vet also gave us something called Vetericyn. IF YOUR BIRD EVER HAS A WOUND I STRONGLY SUGGEST ASKING FOR THIS PRODUCT! ITS AWESOME. The wound was again very deep, into the muscle, with a large scab surrounding the outer area, looking terrible (the vet took a picture....). Today the scab is gone, it actually debrided the wound. It was a little pink and swollen yesterday, but with a closer look you could see it was granulation tissue closing the wound. I have read alot about this product and it seems that it can kill many germs including MRSA without harming the tissue and actually claims to increase oxygen level to the site applied for up to 2 days. I wouldnt believe it if I didnt try it. The wound looks like what the last one would have taken 2 weeks to get to this point. Not to mention this stuff isnt greasy and leaves no film or residue. Its safe on mucous membranes and eyes (I did research before applying to my bird). The triple antibiotic I was using (per vet instructions) was leaving residue and inhibiting his ability to fluff and stay warm. Not anymore!
We have an appointment to see the vet at the 3 weeks mark. I feel confident that the wound will be gone within a week. The question is whether or not he will still attack the wing due to nerve pain and whether or not he may have to be on the nerve medicine forever, or even the collar forever. My husband and I will love him and care for him no matter what it takes. We are hoping we can make him comfortable and happy. He is a fighter and we have our fingers crossed.
I will try and post the pic the vet took to show you the wound for reference.
We still are speculating whether or not he will fly ever again, but in the grande scheme of things, thats on the middle/bottom of the list right now.
Jessica
"Wally" IRN Male DOH 3/8/09
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ellieelectrons
- Posts: 2708
- Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:17 am
- Location: Sunshine Coast, Queensland, Australia
Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
I'm glad you are having some success. I hope it continues and Wally forgets about chewing his wing.
Thanks for sharing how you are going.
Good luck!
Ellie.
Thanks for sharing how you are going.
Good luck!
Ellie.
Re: How quickly things can go wrong!
What an adventure you are having with Wally. I am glad you didn't settle for a vet who just wanted your money and found one that could care for him (I'm annoyed at your first vet now, mind PMing me the name so I can avoid?). Thank you for the information on Vetericyn as well!
Onward and upward, Wally.
Onward and upward, Wally.
I've been called 'birdbrained' before, but somehow I don't think this is what they meant. say:hah-nay