Hey Guys,
Mia has been really good lately, she has been stepping up onto my arm, when a treat is resting on it. She has been exploring myself and the computer area (next to her cage). She has been very good and is seeming to be quite comfortable when she is on me and around me, away from her cage. She has been stepping up from my head and arm on command and has been going very well.
When she is on me and out on the bench I offer her the treat bowl. My method there is for her to know when she gets out, she gets treats, to encourage her to get out. The only worry I have with that is that she is not reliant on me for the treats, not sure what to do there, I think only I will offer treats for her when she's out.
When she is out, she is constantly active and exploring which I hope is a good thing. The only problem is that when she is over near my hand she goes around to bit my fingers and she bites really, really hard, often breaking skin. I'm quite sure this is testing but it is just really painful. When she is on me I wear a thick hoodie so she cannot bit my ears, arms and so on. I also cover my hands at the end with it because I just don't really want to be bitten. I'm not too sure if this is a good thing but is there any other way she can get used to be other than biting until I bleed?
I want her to get used to me but I just cannot be comfortable around her unless she stops this biting. When she is on my head she will very often come down to the front of my face and try to bite my forehead, she used to until I stopped her from doing that by tilting my head until she was forced to walk back.
I'm very happy that she is stepping up and confidently sitting around me but this biting is too much, I would love it much much more if I was more comfortable around her and was able to have her around her with her not biting at all or trying to bite my face, it would be good if she could just sit on my shoulder or just contently on my hand or wander around me with me being terrified her biting me.
Mia also crouches down and looks at me from the inside on her cage as well, squawking occasionally. I'm fine with this I'm just very curious to what this is.
Any advise/info/links would be greatly appreciated thank you!
Cheers,
Jack
*EDIT*
Also, she really goes out of her way to bite my fingers, a tiny bit of my fingers will be showing from under my sleeve and she will go upside-down, on the underside of my arm to bite them.
Step up biting
Moderator: Mods
Step up biting
Mia!
Re: Step up biting
Hi Jack,
Is it possible your bird is still not certain about your fingers? It's hard for me to tell, since you say she is stepping up, but is she just coming to your arm and not your fingers? If so, Rocky has been through this.
For my little Rockstar, it was simply a matter of having him steady on the wrist and treating until he grew confident and stopped testing my arm. His testing was not hard and I interpreted it as a bird version of ambivalence - "safe or not safe?.... nibble.... ooooh, I dunno!.... nibble, nibble.... gee, tough question!" Once he was cool with the arm, however, he ventured on to test the fingers. As you may have discovered, the level of uncertainty directly influences the severity of the bite.
If this is what's happening to you, I suggest gently (which is to say, slowly and GENTLY) blocking the bite with a small, favoured toy. You don't want to use a food distraction because to do so might train the bird to bite and then look for a treat. When she goes to bite, having the toy nearby, just use it to deflect the bite or else arrange so the bite lands on the toy instead of you. Be graceful about it; use finesse. You must be absolutely sure your arm is rock steady and the bird has no cause for alarm, and keep your fingers curled up.
The bird needs to be confident on your arm before you ask her to chill out about your fingers. She knows fingers mean business! Once she is good on the arm, then you can extend one finger and lure her towards it with a treat. Eventually she'll snatch the treat and retreat. Once she does that, it's just practice, practice, until she is OK to go out and stand on the finger. Use tiny pieces of very high value treats. I would expect finger biting to cease soon after that. If she still bites the finger while she has gone quite close to it, reintroduce the toy blocking.
With regard to her biting your ears and face, may I gently suggest that if you know the bird bites and you continue to allow her access to these areas, you are just asking for trouble. Prevent her access until she is more reliable.
-MissK
Is it possible your bird is still not certain about your fingers? It's hard for me to tell, since you say she is stepping up, but is she just coming to your arm and not your fingers? If so, Rocky has been through this.
For my little Rockstar, it was simply a matter of having him steady on the wrist and treating until he grew confident and stopped testing my arm. His testing was not hard and I interpreted it as a bird version of ambivalence - "safe or not safe?.... nibble.... ooooh, I dunno!.... nibble, nibble.... gee, tough question!" Once he was cool with the arm, however, he ventured on to test the fingers. As you may have discovered, the level of uncertainty directly influences the severity of the bite.
If this is what's happening to you, I suggest gently (which is to say, slowly and GENTLY) blocking the bite with a small, favoured toy. You don't want to use a food distraction because to do so might train the bird to bite and then look for a treat. When she goes to bite, having the toy nearby, just use it to deflect the bite or else arrange so the bite lands on the toy instead of you. Be graceful about it; use finesse. You must be absolutely sure your arm is rock steady and the bird has no cause for alarm, and keep your fingers curled up.
The bird needs to be confident on your arm before you ask her to chill out about your fingers. She knows fingers mean business! Once she is good on the arm, then you can extend one finger and lure her towards it with a treat. Eventually she'll snatch the treat and retreat. Once she does that, it's just practice, practice, until she is OK to go out and stand on the finger. Use tiny pieces of very high value treats. I would expect finger biting to cease soon after that. If she still bites the finger while she has gone quite close to it, reintroduce the toy blocking.
With regard to her biting your ears and face, may I gently suggest that if you know the bird bites and you continue to allow her access to these areas, you are just asking for trouble. Prevent her access until she is more reliable.
-MissK
-MissK
Re: Step up biting
Sounds like really good advice thanks,
She seem ok with bare arms, she used to climb up them when she would fly over to the couch, she wouldn't bite or anything but she would go directly to my shoulder. I will make sure to direct her to my arms with a nice treat, so she remains comfortable there, I have the perfect leather chew toy for the blocking, I could use that or just some cardboard (she loves chewing on cardboard).
I will have to test it out today, hopefully the blocking works but won't this not be letting her test my arm out?
Thank you very much for the advice, I will make sure to put it to good use!
Cheers,
Jack
P.S. Does anyone still know what this looking at me (and occasionally squawking) is?
She seem ok with bare arms, she used to climb up them when she would fly over to the couch, she wouldn't bite or anything but she would go directly to my shoulder. I will make sure to direct her to my arms with a nice treat, so she remains comfortable there, I have the perfect leather chew toy for the blocking, I could use that or just some cardboard (she loves chewing on cardboard).
I will have to test it out today, hopefully the blocking works but won't this not be letting her test my arm out?
Thank you very much for the advice, I will make sure to put it to good use!
Cheers,
Jack
P.S. Does anyone still know what this looking at me (and occasionally squawking) is?
Mia!
Re: Step up biting
If you are quite gentle and subtle about blocking the bite, you will not be scaring her. Your blocking should be so gentle, like loving guidance. And you should be keeping your arm rock steady. The fact that she is actually ON your arm when she goes to test tells me she has already decided you are safe enough to climb. If she is not very confident, she may bite you for that, or if there is something else you are doing (like wobbling, lifting the arm, etc) she doesn't like, she may seek reassurance for that.
You can increase her confidence by giving her a fantastic treat, BUT you must be very careful that she doesn't get the message that her biting brought on a treat! If you can lure her onto the arm with the treat, and then keep popping them in her mouth without giving her a chance to start to bite, that might work in your favour. Treating by hand is, in my opinion, the gold standard, but if your timing is not perfect you run a serious risk of training her to bite. As well, you don't want to have to always stuff treats in her to keep her too busy to bite.
While Rocky was working on this issue I noted that he didn't like:
arm moving at all
fingers even slightly uncurled
wrist bent
forearm held not perfectly level
anything else moving in the immediate area (maybe a 5 foot radius)
*if you keep that forearm level with or higher than your shoulder, you will discourage her from running to the shoulder and biting the ear
I *did* use a food lure to bring him onto my wrist, and once the hardest biting had subsided I used more food lure than blocking. But, I had 9 months prior experience dealing with him, and we had reached a bit of an agreement about biting already, when we were "discussing" me putting my hands near him in the cage. I am really hesitant to recommend you using food because I am so concerned about your timing. I have no reason to think your timing isn't good, but it is a skill and if you haven't got it good yet, this is not the area to practice it.
I realize I just said "Food works but don't use it." Sorry about that. Maybe I can relax enough to suggest you might try, just once or twice, popping a treat in her mouth after a very successful block, and see where that takes you. Then you can be treating the behaviour of "accepting a block" rather than biting or blackmailing the human for a treat.
Let us know how it goes.
-MissK
You can increase her confidence by giving her a fantastic treat, BUT you must be very careful that she doesn't get the message that her biting brought on a treat! If you can lure her onto the arm with the treat, and then keep popping them in her mouth without giving her a chance to start to bite, that might work in your favour. Treating by hand is, in my opinion, the gold standard, but if your timing is not perfect you run a serious risk of training her to bite. As well, you don't want to have to always stuff treats in her to keep her too busy to bite.
While Rocky was working on this issue I noted that he didn't like:
arm moving at all
fingers even slightly uncurled
wrist bent
forearm held not perfectly level
anything else moving in the immediate area (maybe a 5 foot radius)
*if you keep that forearm level with or higher than your shoulder, you will discourage her from running to the shoulder and biting the ear
I *did* use a food lure to bring him onto my wrist, and once the hardest biting had subsided I used more food lure than blocking. But, I had 9 months prior experience dealing with him, and we had reached a bit of an agreement about biting already, when we were "discussing" me putting my hands near him in the cage. I am really hesitant to recommend you using food because I am so concerned about your timing. I have no reason to think your timing isn't good, but it is a skill and if you haven't got it good yet, this is not the area to practice it.
I realize I just said "Food works but don't use it." Sorry about that. Maybe I can relax enough to suggest you might try, just once or twice, popping a treat in her mouth after a very successful block, and see where that takes you. Then you can be treating the behaviour of "accepting a block" rather than biting or blackmailing the human for a treat.
Let us know how it goes.
-MissK
-MissK
Re: Step up biting
Hey,
We tried once today (I didn't have the nerve to get bitten again). She was ok, this all happened before I read your post, earlier today (she just didn't want to step up or play in the afternoon), she had my dad about 2 feet away from me. She bit my forearm and then ran up my arm and sat on my shoulder for about 3 minutes before biting my shoulder-neck area. I put her back in her cage then.
I tried to get some of her little rope that she likes to block it, but its very difficult to get the timing right and to place it there correctly. She came up onto my brother in the afternoon, with the sleeve, it worked out well, she tried to bite him a lot but the surface was too slippery for her to get a grip. It was good, he held his arm higher than his shoulder and head and she stayed there. She was quite calm, except the fact she was looking for a bit of skin to 'test' or bite.
This was ok, I just need to get a decent toy that can block some of her bites. When she did bite me I tried to get her to stop with a subtle "Ttttsss" sound but she didn't really stop or cease. Is there a way that I could get her to stop her bite or cease a little?
She has gotten to the point that she is confident to step up on me and climb on me, which is good, this biting is just difficult to get by and it does hurt a lot (I may just be a bit soft, but it does). I need to get the blocking and timing down pat.
When will she be able to sit confidently on me and step up on my without biting me constantly? When can she just be able to step up onto my finger/hand/wrist? When will she be tame enough to have full confidence in me? Just curious.
Cheers,
Jack
We tried once today (I didn't have the nerve to get bitten again). She was ok, this all happened before I read your post, earlier today (she just didn't want to step up or play in the afternoon), she had my dad about 2 feet away from me. She bit my forearm and then ran up my arm and sat on my shoulder for about 3 minutes before biting my shoulder-neck area. I put her back in her cage then.
I tried to get some of her little rope that she likes to block it, but its very difficult to get the timing right and to place it there correctly. She came up onto my brother in the afternoon, with the sleeve, it worked out well, she tried to bite him a lot but the surface was too slippery for her to get a grip. It was good, he held his arm higher than his shoulder and head and she stayed there. She was quite calm, except the fact she was looking for a bit of skin to 'test' or bite.
This was ok, I just need to get a decent toy that can block some of her bites. When she did bite me I tried to get her to stop with a subtle "Ttttsss" sound but she didn't really stop or cease. Is there a way that I could get her to stop her bite or cease a little?
She has gotten to the point that she is confident to step up on me and climb on me, which is good, this biting is just difficult to get by and it does hurt a lot (I may just be a bit soft, but it does). I need to get the blocking and timing down pat.
When will she be able to sit confidently on me and step up on my without biting me constantly? When can she just be able to step up onto my finger/hand/wrist? When will she be tame enough to have full confidence in me? Just curious.
Cheers,
Jack
Mia!
Re: Step up biting
Ah, Jack. 
She will stop doing those things when her confidence and motivation exceed her fear.
Be sure to use a toy she already likes for blocking. If you introduce a novel item then you might scare her with it. Scaring = bad and counterproductive.
Also, it sounds like she is being made to climb on the arm on a sleeve. Let her go on bare skin. When she goes on the sleeve and it moves under her this makes her less confident. She needs secure footing.
-MissK
She will stop doing those things when her confidence and motivation exceed her fear.
Be sure to use a toy she already likes for blocking. If you introduce a novel item then you might scare her with it. Scaring = bad and counterproductive.
Also, it sounds like she is being made to climb on the arm on a sleeve. Let her go on bare skin. When she goes on the sleeve and it moves under her this makes her less confident. She needs secure footing.
-MissK
-MissK