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I just checked my boxes today and my Lutino pair (M-4-5YO), (F-2YO(1st time breeding) laid 7 eggs!!!!! The most I have ever had in the last 2 years was 1 clutch of 4. This year, they have 7 and my other pair who has laid had 5!!! Unfortunaty it is looking like I will have 25-30 babbies to feed here shortly.

Congratulations Jim;

It means you are really looking after them.

Which are your breeding conditions:

lighting schedule ... is it natural or you are controlling lights on anf off?
are they with acces to direct sun light? did you give them extravitamines or vit D supplements?
seeds ... which is your misture? how much fruits and vegi you give them? how much sunflower seeds?
are they in an aviary? are they in separate cages? can the different pairs see each others?

I will really appreciate if you give us the "key" of your succes

Cheers

Recio

Recio, first off, let me say ANY success I have had I have to attribute it to Brain Wootan in Galveston. By far he is the most knowledgeable person on breeding I have ever talked to. His care for his birds are second to none and his flock boasts a 98% fertility rate for the past several years.

I have three cages set up in my backyard, overall 4X9X5 so each pen is 3ft wide. Nest boxes are inside the cages.

They get natural light, but the cages are surrounded under an umbrella of trees, they get direct early morning light and late afternoon as well.

Feeding is seed every other day, (its gone in an hour), lots of sweet potato supplemented with cooked deer corn, fresh apples, broccoli, jalapenos, carrots, green beans beets and turnips. For pellet I have been feeding Mazuri just recently but was feeding pretty bird. (which they didn’t seem to like), but that is what Brian feeds.

For water, they get a couple tble spoons of vinegar in a gallon of water 7 days on and 7 days off. I also empty a capsule of MSM in the gallon of water when I think about it. Another friend, Dona, who owns Perching At The Ritz swears by it. She used to be the largest cockatoo breeder in the U.S. at one time, but has been trying to close the doors. (for about 10 years now I think).

Other than that, I pretty much left them alone once they started laying and let nature take its course.

I have got several other tips like using hardware cloth o(or larger for larger birds) to make for better perches when mating. I have the walls between the cages doubled so no toes get lost, but they see each other and I even see them flirting between the cages.

I threw a small cuttle bone in each nest box before they started to lay when the hen was working it. This way she would get all the nutrients, so I am thinking she was able to lay more because she had that extra in her system.


I had heard of someone having 9 eggs once, but dont think but about 5 of them hatched.

No magic bullets, but hope this is what you were looking for.

Congrats on the 7 eggs---lets hope they all hatch for you.My Lutino last season laid 6 eggs but only two hatched and of the two only one survived.It was their first year of breeding.
Now I have a cuple of questions for you------
Why do you put the vinegar in the water?
What exactly is MSM?

Not saying theres anything wrong with your ideas-----just curious.
Lets face it ---the more good ideas we can get --the better luck we will have with breeding and bird health etc.

Apparently by placing a couple tablespoons of vinagar in the water, no gram negitive bacteria can live in their crop. A seven day regiment apparently cleans it out.

MSM is Methylsufonylmethane, which is a "A Fundamental source of nutritional sulfer , a naturally occurring nutrient". The label says MSM is a natural part of every cell function and is concentrated in the connective tissues of the skin, nails, and hair..."

I have no idea what it does, but she swears by it. BAsically, the bottle was free, it has 250 capsuls, and she feeds it to her birds, so I empty a capsule in a gallon a water. It doesnt seem to hurt, and I dont know its full effects, since they probably only get it 12-15 days out of the month. Personally I would not waste my money on supplements if I am feeding pellet, veggies and fruit to begin with. At some point I think our birds are eating healthier than us. (Healthier than me for sure).

Jim

JimHcctx wrote:Apparently by placing a couple tablespoons of vinagar in the water, no gram negitive bacteria can live in their crop. A seven day regiment apparently cleans it out.

MSM is Methylsufonylmethane, which is a "A Fundamental source of nutritional sulfer , a naturally occurring nutrient". The label says MSM is a natural part of every cell function and is concentrated in the connective tissues of the skin, nails, and hair..."

Hi Jim;

Thanks for your complete answer.

About vineager (acetic acid): is it apple or wine vineager? Probably it does not matter which it comes from, since it acts by acidifyng the stomach-bowel content. Gram negative bacteria form part of the normal crop bacterial environement of a healthy bird. The problem is when they develop further and become the predominant bacteria. I guess vineager acts avoiding this gram negative proliferation.

About MSM: as you say it acts on connective tissues and also on inmunoglobulines and as an antiallergic agent. This sulfur occurs naturally in fruits and vegies but mainly on animals products: fish, meat and specially milk. IRN eat meat: I have seen my IRN eating grasshoppers coming into his aviary and is known that they like chicken. I had a pair of budgerigar in the same aviary with my IRN. The hen was not in a great form and when I came back from my weekend travel, there was not any female budgerigar, just some yellow feathers: they had eaten the female. Somethings else: I have a lutino which used to lay a 4-5 eggs per clutch. Last year I gave her bread with milk before laying and I got six fertile eggs. This year I am giving dry bread with milk to all my pairs and I have seen that most fo birds eating this mixture are females ... can they "feel" the presence of calcium they need for shells and bones? Probably ... Milk is rich in calcium and sulfur.

Personally I would not waste my money on supplements if I am feeding pellet, veggies and fruit to begin with. At some point I think our birds are eating healthier than us.

I completely agree ... just looking for "natural" supplements may be it is better to offer them a beat of chicken and milk from time to time, or at least during the laying-breeding period.

Best regards and thank you for your answer Jim

Recio

I thought I had read somewhere that birds did not receive milk as babies and did not digest it well. Even milk producst such as some cheeses were problematic to digest. With that said, my Green wing macaw loves cheddar cheese.

Anyway, the vinager is Apple Cider Vinager.

I might have to try out some milk and see what happens.

thanks

Jim

I think if I am not getting 100% fertility I am going to replace all the perches with harware cloth 2x2 perches and shave their vents for the next clutch. With him breeding her that many times, it might be necessary to ensure they have the best grip and the least obstructions when making contact. I want to see what round one does.

I am also going to try a little bold of milk soaked pellets and see if they get near it.

thanks
Jim

JimHcctx wrote:I thought I had read somewhere that birds did not receive milk as babies and did not digest it well. Even milk producst such as some cheeses were problematic to digest. With that said, my Green wing macaw loves cheddar cheese.
I might have to try out some milk and see what happens.

Hi Jim,
I had read the same than you, but, you know, on the web you can read something and its opposite ... so, I prefere to test by myself. Maybe it has been shown that milk is indigestif when you give it directly to hanreared chicks. I guess it is not the same when it has passed through the parents stomach. We 'll see what happen ...
I offer the bread and milk mixture at the same time than carots, apples, ... and seeds, ... and they choose what they want. They are very smart guys and know what is good for them.

Recio

BIG NEWS and I don't quiete know what to make of it(?) My other pair in the next age which to the best of my knowledge is completely unrelated is a Old Blue Male who lost his mate last year. I had purchased a 2nd pair of lutino's which I suspected were Brother and Sister this summer at a mart.

I through the old Blue in with the pair figuring the three could live together and if he paired up with one or the other then I would at least know I had a pair (we just guessed at the mart trying to pick a boy and girl). Anyway the blue did pair up with one of the lutinos. I suspect both of the lutinos are only 1 year old, but she worked the nest box and did lay.

After the 1st egg, I gave her what I thought was an approprate amount of time, finding she had laid 5 eggs. She is nesting right up against the wall that you raise the lid on so the eggs are hard to see and you have to stand tall to get a good look.

Every time I come around to feed she exits the nest box, so I looked again a few days later to ensure everything was ok and found she had laid a 6th egg. At the time I assumed that I had just missed, not being able to see to clearly the spot where she was laying.

This monring I was out there and checked the box, SHE TOO HAS 7 EGGS!!!! The only down side of this is the old blue male and his previous mate had four the year before and all four were infertile. So I am not sure or not if he is shooting blanks.

The bad news, is that 2 nights ago my green lacewing got its beak hung in the cage. He must ahve fought it all night as the top and bottom beak were damaged, one eye lost its eye lids, and part of its face seperated from the lower jaw. I found him trying to eat that monring, brought him inside and tried to save him, but it just didnt work out. He died yesterday monring. His mate is now wothout a male, and the only male I have left is one legged and its too late in the season to move him in with her I think (?)

Hi Jim;

Congratulations ... we are going to call you the seven eggs-man
7 eggs for a one year old first time laying hen is a real good performance. Are you sure there are not hormones in the pellets you give them?

So sorry for your male ...but you are in Texas .... you still have enough time to try to pair the hen with the unlegged male. It does not matter if he just has a leg, he can perfectly perform.

Bets regards

Recio

I moved the male, he was with a 1 year old green female and I wasnt interested in a bunch of green birds, so if he takes, Ill get gray and blue lacewings and if not, at least I will know he cant breed. Her mom was 6 eggs every clutch so I am hoping to AT LEAST get that (Now I am just getting greedy).

One last item I forgot to tell you that I fed was that I slow-cook deer corn in crock pots and feed that every other day as well. My buddy tells me it has a lot of calcium and I have been doing that for a bout a year now, so that might be something too. Who knows..

I'll let you know if the one-legged male fertilizes them or not.