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Recio wrote:Hi,

Royal Blue is a colour with a wavelength of 450 nm. It is a deep dark azure colour. It is close to the uv wavelength in the ligth spectrum and it si able to induce fluorescence like the uv.

Madas, do not forget your uv ligth ... and keep us enligthed

Regards

Recio

PS: it would be great to look at those birds with a royal blue ligth.

Hi Guys,

back from the exhibition i am confused more then ever regarding dark, violet and 'deep'.
Pics will follow tomorrow. Haven't checked them for quality until now.

greetings.

madas

First impression. Unfortunately the pic doesn't reflect the full beauty and purple richness of this bird.
I have never seen such bird before.





mother and father (unfortunately no other pic; they were very sprightly); mother was visually lighter compared to the father.



Both parents don't carry the common violet factor. So what am i???
I don't know.

cleartail mauve violet:

What am I the second???

Psittacula columboides:

Hi madas

The pic of the blue Dom/edged is a great pic
Did you see any other edged birds on your trip.

Madas, you are a legend. Fantastic pics, thank you!

As fot the violet offspring, what a beautiful bird. The genetic make up will probably be a mystery for some time to come. Perhaps you have booked one of the future offspring? To me, it seems like the father is a bit darker than the mother. I would classify the offspring bird in the region of DF violet (reminds me of NT) SF dark. Perhaps DF violet SF deep? But I'm guessing.

madas wrote:What am I the second???

One of my favourite birds! Blue SL dom. edged misty with/without cinnamon (not sure). That bird in cobalt violet would be one for any collection. Add to that a cobalt violet opaline cleartail, and I think you'd have the two of the most beautiful combinations possible.

madas wrote:Psittacula columboides:

Another of my favourites. You really spoiled us! I haven't seen such good quality pics of Malabars yet. Any chance of emerald collared parakeets?

Great pics Madas. The mystery Blue bird when you blow it up there is the tell tale mauve blush on the face and neck so I make the father a Dark TurquoiseBlue. The hen looks to have a Dark factor and one other unknown factor. IMO the chick is a combination of all 3.

The hen looks to have a Dark factor and one other unknown factor. IMO the chick is a combination of all 3.

Just realised how dumb that was. 2 Dark factors makes a Mauve so I am mystified again.

Tartan ringnecks wrote: Hi madas
The pic of the blue Dom/edged is a great pic
Did you see any other edged birds on your trip.

Unfortunately not.

Ring0Neck wrote:Madas,

Thanks a mil for the pics.

The parent male's ring color was it a soft pink?

Did you see if the inside tail was white ?

Did you or can you ask if that briliant purple offspring got darker much darker then before first molt?

first question: yes. second: no, i haven't payed attenion to it. third: haven't but i will try to get this info.

Johan S wrote:Madas, you are a legend. Fantastic pics, thank you!

As fot the violet offspring, what a beautiful bird. The genetic make up will probably be a mystery for some time to come. Perhaps you have booked one of the future offspring? To me, it seems like the father is a bit darker than the mother. I would classify the offspring bird in the region of DF violet (reminds me of NT) SF dark. Perhaps DF violet SF deep? But I'm guessing.

thx. Phenotype was like your violet(df) dark(sf) blue but without the greyish washover. Yeah as i wrote the father was steps darker then the mother. But both haven't showed any sign of violet. Very strange. I was promised one bird of each phenotype. Means one of the mother, one of the father and one of the combined offspring. But this has to wait some years. For now we have made an agreement that the owner should try (and hopefully will do) to breed dubble-factor birds of each parents phenotype. Pretty sure one of the pairing is giving us mauves and the other some kind of violet bird.

Johan S wrote: One of my favourite birds! Blue SL dom. edged misty with/without cinnamon (not sure). That bird in cobalt violet would be one for any collection. Add to that a cobalt violet opaline cleartail, and I think you'd have the two of the most beautiful combinations possible.

Yeah, but they were not exhibited as SL edged birds.

Johan S wrote: Another of my favourites. You really spoiled us! I haven't seen such good quality pics of Malabars yet. Any chance of emerald collared parakeets?

I do my best. ;) Yeah very nice birds. regarding the emerald collared parakeets: they were not exhibited.

greetings.

madas

And some more pics:

0,1 NSLino:




0,1 rec. "yellow" (this bird has dark eyes or very dark red eyes then zoomed into the eye ):




both together:



Both birds are out of cleartail lines. We know that some cleartail lines are throwing birds with dark eyes (Tienie has one or two). But is it possible that the red eye of a lutino could change to black caused by the same mutation which is producing the black eyes of the non-lutino birds out of cleartail lines???
Btw: the 0,1 rec. "yellow" is showing a slight red shine on the head in the under eye section.

madas

1,0 opaline greygreen (with a slight pink neckring):

And some more:





Your thoughts???

madas wrote:

Johan S wrote: One of my favourite birds! Blue SL dom. edged misty with/without cinnamon (not sure). That bird in cobalt violet would be one for any collection. Add to that a cobalt violet opaline cleartail, and I think you'd have the two of the most beautiful combinations possible.

Yeah, but they were not exhibited as SL edged birds.

What were they called?

As for the last of the new pics. What a strange cock bird. Looks mauve at the neck, but very light blue rump for a mauve.

Johan S wrote: What were they called?

"Fusi". A new sex-linked incomplete dominant Mutation.
We had a big disccusion on this topic here in Germany. Most breeder think it's nothing more then SL edged combined with misty and cinnamon.
But unfortunately no breeder who is owning SL edged was able to exhibit his birds. So we haven't got the chance to compare both expressions.

Johan S wrote: As for the last of the new pics. What a strange cock bird. Looks mauve at the neck, but very light blue rump for a mauve.

Do you speak of the last pic with two cleartail birds??? No Mauve on it. ;)

Well, if "fusi" is a single mutation, and not a combination of three, I would very much like to have one. Then my dream bird of cobalt violet "fusi" would be much simpler to breed. Only one or two years.

Johan S wrote:Well, if "fusi" is a single mutation, and not a combination of three, I would very much like to have one. Then my dream bird of cobalt violet "fusi" would be much simpler to breed. Only one or two years.

Yeah and that's why the knowledge of the cross-over rate between cinnamon and SL edged is very important to know. The breeder said he hasn't breed any normal cinnamon or SL edged bird out of "fusi" males. So if it is a combination then cinnamon and edged must be very close linked. So that they can't be splited easily. But if i remember correct Tienie had a feeling that the crossover rate is high resp. normal (50:50). If it is true then "fusi" could be a single mutation. Time will tell.

The first "fusi" bird was bought by him from a bird trader of Belgium. So no info on the parents.

madas wrote:For now we have made an agreement that the owner should try (and hopefully will do) to breed dubble-factor birds of each parents phenotype. Pretty sure one of the pairing is giving us mauves and the other some kind of violet bird.

I completely missed this part, but agree 100% on the mauves and violets.

Mada's -thanks for the eye candy- that Greygreen Opaline is one cool looking bird, and the first bird- just wow! you can see the density there even if the colour isn't an accurate depiction, compelling!

Ring0Neck wrote: can you see how the color changes according to diff lighting conditions?
it is almost an illusion almost in constant change
http://parakeet.me/irn/f/DSC_0170.jpg
btw this is the darkest chick - see pic below: the 1 on the left 9o'clock in the bucket 12 is an sf violet for reference
http://parakeet.me/irn/f/PICT1005.JPG

I know what you mean about constant change- one of my hen's does that- very confusing, the chicks in the bucket- are they unrelated? what is the one down on the bottom?- which parents, and what mutations do you know of so far for the chicks?

Sorry bout the hoard of questions- just trying to (quickly) understand whom is from whom-

madas wrote:First impression. Unfortunately the pic doesn't reflect the full beauty and purple richness of this bird.
I have never seen such bird before.





mother and father (unfortunately no other pic; they were very sprightly); mother was visually lighter compared to the father.



Both parents don't carry the common violet factor. So what am i???
I don't know.

Hi great Madas,

Great pics. Thaaaaaanks a loooot!!!

Is the bird a female? Is the father opaline? Look at the father's ring: despite the great amount of psittacin we can see in the wings and saddle area, the ring does not show any red pigment (or really an extremely low amount) and the black part of the ring is wider than usually, just like we can see in opaline males. If the father is opaline and opaline has something to do with the apparent colour of the bird, then this bird must be a female. Is it? I know that the bird does not show the typical opaline wing markings ... but which other mutation does induce an increase in psittacin expression and a wider black ring? Could opaline markings be altered by the presence of other mutations?

Something else: the nails of this bird are not specially dark, but they look ligther than in a wild bird ... this means that, a priori, this is not any (new) melanistic mutation.
Maybe we should try to add Opaline to the different mix of Blue, Deep, Dark and Violet, in order to get darker/purple birds.

Regards

Recio

Recio wrote: Hi great Madas,

Great pics. Thaaaaaanks a loooot!!!

Is the bird a female? Is the father opaline? Look at the father's ring: despite the great amount of psittacin we can see in the wings and saddle area, the ring does not show any red pigment (or really an extremely low amount) and the black part of the ring is wider than usually, just like we can see in opaline males. If the father is opaline and opaline has something to do with the apparent colour of the bird, then this bird must be a female. Is it? I know that the bird does not show the typical opaline wing markings ... but which other mutation does induce an increase in psittacin expression and a wider black ring? Could opaline markings be altered by the presence of other mutations?

Something else: the nails of this bird are not specially dark, but they look ligther than in a wild bird ... this means that, a priori, this is not any (new) melanistic mutation.
Maybe we should try to add Opaline to the different mix of Blue, Deep, Dark and Violet, in order to get darker/purple birds.

Regards

Recio

thx. No the male isn't a opaline and isn't out of opaline lines. Both parents are split for CHF. The breeder told me he got the same Color in CHF. So i will request a pic.
regarding the wider ringneck. There are some normal male IRNs which are showing wider ringnecks too. It's not a feature which is only specific for opalines. Look into Bastiaans books there are some males with wider ringnecks which were not opalines.

madas

Ring0Neck wrote: emerald turquoise opaline/ct
http://parakeet.me/irn/f/PA255818.JPG

Wow, great body head contrast for a Youngster. Any pic of the Opaline father?

thx.

Violet Emerald under-wing pic

This matches my Violet EmeraldBlue

Ben, we see a similar orange/brownish colour in our grey turqblue SL edged birds. A similar thing happens when replacing edged with cinnamon in that combination. We should see the same effect in a pied in regions where the pied mutation changes the melanin into a greyish shade with psittacin overlayed.