Agree or disagree...

[Mikaela]

I believe the cockatiel is the best bird for the first time bird owner.

I also believe it takes a special devotion on both the birds part and the owners part to tame an IRN, if that is your first bird.

If people bought the right bird the first time, far less would have to be placed many times. This is why I think this topic is important.

Sound Off:

[baby_bella]

i totally argee with you m.

ive had so many werro's as we aussies call em! and they have helped me understand birds and everything... not saying there a irn but they are great 1st time birds for anyone... once you go any higher parrot then a werro it gets more difficult.

actually went into thepet shop yesterday and they had the cutest werro siting there on the stand... just sitting there i pick him up gave him some strichs and he loved it was very cute how they put there heads right down to do that to em...

i would like another werro but i want all these birds and my parrents are freakin out cause im getting 2 for christmas (yay im getting my eclectus in jan!) so i dont think any more babies are on the way!

[ScarletKnight]

like anything buying a house, car, choosing a college, marriage you gotta do research talk to breeders there are some people who shouldn't even own a stuffed bird. First cardinal rule of bird ownership is research tiels are easy to work with and are frendly but that doesn't make them the right bird for people to own as first. look for info read not every1 is meant to own a bird *sigh** read look at situation read some more and then reevaluate then buy or adopt. this is where i got in trouble the first time and stop coming here for a while. Irn are great birds and can be owned by a well informed first time bird owner who is commited. it more on a individual level where which bird is right for u or not so plese donot label a breed as better then other in brad statement. My first personal bird was a h macaw yes the one that cost 10000$ plus who plucked and that bird worked for me. goes to show u it all up to individuals what you have to work with. And again i gonna say IRN make a wonderful first time pets. please don't label them as the hardest thing the world to work with U2 are the hardest i found because they demand a lot . Irn no. My nephew just got a gray irn that i gave him for a pet and yes it is his first bird and the bird is working out.

[Jade]

I believe that if you are a first time bird owner, you should get a bird that has been handraised by someone else. After you have built up confidence with the bird and learn what makes a bird happy, mad, pissed off, cute and cuddly etc, then you are ready to maybe step up and take on a bird to be trained by yourself.

I think it is too much of a feat of endurance and patience to get an older bird with minimal training and try and convert it to your new best friend. Sometimes it might work, sometimes not. Like a stray dog, some can be good and some are just forever nasty and suspicious.

That's my opinon anyway!

[Mikaela]

I couldnt agree more Jade. God bless those that adopt but I WOULD NEVER again adopt another bird, unless is was a baby and those arent unwanted yet because the owner hasnt lost its patience. hehe

I do not agree however, that every IRN or bird/animal for that matter can be a good pet if the right amount of attention is given. I totally disagree with that. I have too many online and offline friends that have done exactly as told but the bird still bites, lunges and flees, even after MONTHS of trying to even get him or her to not FREAK when the cage is approached. Some animals simply DO NOT make good pets. Look at the hell Jen has been through and I know she has done all she can do.

With a 'tiel the bites are a joke. They are alot calmer. It gives a first time owner sort of a live stuffed animal to work with before diving in.

In most cases when a bird will not 'come around to you' it has nothing to do with YOU but tramas the bird fears or have endured. I wouldnt want owners whom are having no success with their IRN's, after months of immense COMMITMENT to think they failed because they didnt do enough. Sometimes, nothing is ever enough. After months of trying there comes a time where you have to give up.

[ScarletKnight]

and i have put alot of those lovign unwanted screaming etc ect babies in nice loving homes after a few months of clicker training. I implore jen and every1 who has a problems bird to try clicker training. as far as bites goes every bird will bite it goes with the game. you can't play football unless you willing get tackled. the reason why i said i will never give up my bird is that it taught me patience. i had a lot less before i got it. I swear do clicker training with ure bird and u will be amazed how birds come around. yes i agree with the fact that Irn are not for every1 because theya re not cuddley bird but can make a good pets. As far as jen trying everythign possible thats not true i bet if she tries at least 2 month of quality clicker training she be back in the saddle with the bird.
scarlet

[Neokireina]

I'm sorry wth is a werro>>>> (that > is my question mark now seeing as my birds have pulled it off the keyboard and flown away with it and dumped it somewhere for me to find later..) I'm from Australia and I have no idea what your talking about..

[ScarletKnight]

well if it is clicker training involves food, clicker, bird, you and patience. jsut click the behavior want and treat and the birds become frendly just like that.
scarlet

[jen5239]

Ok Scareltknight,
What do u do if your bird is in no way, shape, or form interested in food?? Then what?? Byndi could care less about food. He eats the seeds that he's been raised on and not much else. I can't entice him with anything. And believe me I have tried! He lunges at me and the food like a mad dog ready to kill. I swear he gets this look on his face like he's going to seriously mess you up. And I swear he almost growls. So... You may not think I have done everything possible, and maybe I haven't. But I have worked DAILY with this bird and tried all I can think of and he just doesn't want to interact with me. And he tells me this by ripping my skin off and bruising me from his bites. Which I gladly take cuz I do want this to work. But it's not! It's been over two months and we've hardly progressed at all. So you tell me what to do with this clicker training when he won't go for any food!

[ScarletKnight]

can u wait liek few more months and see what i say works if not then u cna do what ever u want. first start introudcing different food give seede only at dinenr time give me other fruits. i know its hard but he will get hungry enough he will eat. once he changed hsi diet. get a different bowl then his food bowl and then find hsi fav thing in the world click and drop the food in the bowl and click as he eating let me know when u get to this step. if u need further clarification msg me at scarletknight79 on aim or ru_knight79 on yahoo. ciao
scarlet
ps didn't mean to sound condisending it is obious u don't want to get rid of the bird
scarlet

[Ducky]

our first bird was a 13y old tiel that had been caged and ignored so it took time to tame but he was the nicest bird ever with the kids however bad mom i was his wings weren't clipped and out the door he flew when an unexpected visitor was knocking at 3am.

when i got ducky the kids thought she would be just as nice well of course she wasn't so for them i got them a parakeet well there not as thrilled with him i wish I woulda got another tiel.

[Jade]

Bella_baby:

Yeah, what's a werro? I'm here in Queensland and have never heard cockatiels called werros. Your in WA right? I think that is just something your state calls them rather than the whole of Australia. Just the same as IRNs are declared a pest in WA whereas no other state has declared them.

Summary on all points raised herein:

**getting onto my soap box with my angry hat on**

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Each bird is different. It depends on the individual if it will come around or not. Obviously after 3 months or more of repeated attempts and with absolutely no progress whatsoever, you would have to think that maybe the bird is just geared to be unsocial. With an older bird you have no idea what background it came from, or that maybe it had received a head injury by a net when it was being caught in the aviary, or teased by humans through the cage in the pet shop.

For example, I know a heap of you have cockatoos and you all rave about how cute and cuddly your little 'too is. You can't tell me then that if you went out in the bush and plucked a 'too (be it 1 or 100 years old) off a tree branch, took it home and clicker trained it or whatever, that it would be your best friend. That is a wild bird that has NEVER socialised. It is nearly impossible. I know many a person who has been conned into buying an older unsocialised 'too and trust me, they have rarely been successful and the 'too's have much bigger beaks than an IRN, and do a hell of a lot more damage to a finger!

Sorry for getting angry here but I think that no one should judge anyone else in relation to their birds. I think that Jen has tried absolutely everything and I think that its time to just let Byndi hang out in a cage or allow him to become a breeder.

**getting off my soap box now and taking off angry hat**

[jen5239]

Love ya' Jade!!!

[baby_bella]

a werro is a cockatiel we use that as slang term for the bird here .... man you go to avaires and bird shops and there called werros! its pronouced wee-ros! i cant believe no one has heard of them over there! hehe funny... are irn a pest over here too! omg! these creatures are gorgous

[Melika]

I believe the cockatiel is the best bird for the first time bird owner.

I don't believe the cockatiel is the best first bird. No one ever tells you that they're dusty, the males grow older and begin to scream for attention or to talk to the wild birds outside, can bite to bleed, or that they just sit there.

I think the 'tiel is good for a lot of people, but I would reccomend something like a green-cheek conure (they love being rubbed all over, lol) before I would a 'tiel. Birds are addictive and eventually you'll get a larger parrot- but will that little 'tiel soon become boring? For some, they do. And 'tiels do get re-homed and given to bird rescues quite often.

Personally, I think the best first bird is the one you have your heart set on and have researched for. Often peeps will want a grey or other intrigueing parrot but bird people will say, "get a 'tiel first as a stepping stone to a bigger bird." I can honestly say I wouldn't pay much attention to the bird I never wanted when I would finally get my dream bird. And there are always people on bird boards who say they've owned all different kinds of birds- but where are they now? They constanly move on from one species to the next not giving a bird a life-home. And that' just sad. (that last statement does not apply to breeders)

So people should do their research, choose what bird they really want and be prepared to care for that bird its entire life. And not just get a bird because "it's a good first bird". A good first bird for some can be a macaw, lol.

Like you said, Mikaela, "If people bought the right bird the first time, far less would have to be placed many times."

I also believe it takes a special devotion on both the birds part and the owners part to tame an IRN, if that is your first bird.

It definitely takes a special devotion. IRNs are so challenging to raise. And you HAVE to raise them right the first time, lol. You don't get second chances too often with these birds.
And adopting an older IRN is even more difficult. You have to reverse whatever perceptions it has already ingrained into it's psyche and replace them with better images of what humans are to them.

For adopting an older IRN, it would be best to have some experience with birds and their behavior.
But a first time bird owner could be up to the challenge or raising a young one right.

It takes much self-examination and honesty to decide on any species of parrot, IRN or not. Sometimes the bird you want just isn't the kind you need.

My mother would love a Mollucan 'too. But she knows it's not for her. She's allergic to my 'tiel- and that's a lot less dust than a 'too! She wouldn't stand any screaming whatsoever, and she would probably cuddle with it way too much and create a bird with behavior issues. She knows this, no one had to tell her. A hard decision, but best for her and the bird. ^^

[Mikaela]

Melika, Thank you for your view on this topic.

Lets switch gears for a moment now that I have your attention. You mentioned 'toos again and Im still not over my 'too thing so here is my question:

With the exception of at night or when it is too cold, can you keep a Mullucan on a screened lania here... where we live?

I have checked with the homeowners association and they told me I could have everything with feathers except a rooster, I can even have a chicken They make little noise.

Me being an attorney, I made them put that in writting for future reference. Many things happen we dont forsee but I would hate to end up on death row for beating somone about the head and face for telling me my birds had to go. And I would. Ask my ol'man.

[Neokireina]

you go girl, no one gets to take your babies away.

[Melika]

Mazzie's mom may have the best response, but I'll give it a whirl.

I think a 'too is happiest when it's "included" (or thinks it is) in the family activity. Basically, somewhere it can see it's people. Out on a lanai, it may not have the interaction it needs.
For instance, if it's in the home where you visit frequently, you may say hello and give it a scratch as you walk by- or even a treat. You can be more comfortable about leaving it out on a playstand (ever see what a parrot can do to a screen?!) since it's indoors.

But it's important for a too to develop independant play. I just don't think that means it should be isolated away from the family.

Again, I give the floor to Mazzie's mom, lol. ^_^


And your homeowners association can vote to have you either move or ditch anything too noisy, lol. Since a pet and disturbing the peace are two different things. We've been dealing with one where two of our jobs are, and they're fierce. Meanies. And that's over stupid stuff like hedges; not 5-alarm bird noises.

[Mikaela]

Actually they cant if it is stipulated in the homeowners association disclosure. If you gander at my profile you'll see I pretty much know my stuff in this area. Anything in writing is... well in writing. That is why it is referred to as 'etched in stone' because it CANNOT be taken back and amended. Not even in the court of law, much less a ratty lil association.

I get everything in writing. Oral is for the birds, no pun intended but it is useless. Your word against mine, in the court of law, usually (80% of the time) ends in a dismissal. For it not to, there would have to be mounds of circumstances as to why the contract should be over-turned.

My contract is literally worded that 'I may own any animal with feathers with the exception of a rooster'. For other animals, I put in that I may own a dog over 50 pds if the animal undergoes professional training. I dont have, need or want a dog at the moment but one must think ahead. And, if I were to get a dog it would be a boxer so that would exceed the 50 pd limit.

[Jade]

Bella_baby:

I read it on a web site for the WA council. I just typed indian ringneck in google and up it popped. I read it out of interest and they said that a pair of IRNs escaped and bred like made over there. So much so that they now have culls. They net them and sell them (feel sorry for the buyer of these wild birds!). Apparently they kick out the native birds from their nests and because they breed earlier in the season, they take all the good nesting spots meaning the natives are nestless. WA is also perfect weather for them and they are quite prolific.

I'll try and find the site for you to read. My brother and sister in law live in Bunbury and they told me that there are a few wild IRNs that get around out there way.

[ScarletKnight]

homeowners associations are bunch of bullies you go for making them write it down how ever most associations are elected so i think u be better off getting it in writing from the assocaition attorney and having it notorized. now fla is fairly liberal state where they are accomidating for exotic species well except for miami dade county where pitbulls are illegal. you can havea roster also but that will require to get a special lic but that is weell regulated dude to morons figting the birds. anyway i wish you luck on your quest to get a too. i had one for a while he was a plucker i got him fixed and found him a nice home. now he rules the house.
scarlet

[Melika]

We can't have any livestock in our city. But if you have an acre of land you can have one horse. No one has an acre... very few anyway.


Mikaela, can your association later stipulate that there is a noise limit for your pets? Just wondering. My knowledge here is limited to landscape, lol.
So far we've had work approved ahead of time, yes written approval, which later is revoked for silly reasons (jealousy, vendettas, etc.) through vote. And, of course, that's always AFTER the work is complete (and may I say everything we've done is beautiful and to the betterment of the community...). But that is how this particular association is set up. ^^

We haven't removed anything we've done though, lol. The homeowners are just fighting it or refusing. So far the association can't kick them out for that. Silly rich peeps.

[ScarletKnight]

this is exactly why i can't stand homeowners assocaition. mekila case point being what sucks is they can and sometimes do change their minds for petty things. my neighbor had to replace a 1500$ door because one of the assicaitions son parked the car on his assigned spot when it was snowing. while otherside his friend had the same door installed and nothing was said. cnn or fxnws did a report on homeowner associations and how they are out of control. i wish i remembered who.
scarlet

[Mikaela]

Because I am a member of the association they are eager to work with me. We have lived here for three yrs but have outgrown this house so we lucked up on one two streets down. Upside, kids dont have to change schools, life will be changed very little. 4 boys grow fast, they stink too by the way.

I had an interest in being a member for obvious reasons but never persued it. After they learned of my profession, they saw me as an asset as to keep their buget down, they need me much more then them.

Pro bono is a good thing, they enjoy it Im sure.

[Dani03]

I started with a pair of lovely budgies and then moved up to a tiel. Then I bred tiels for a while before deciding to stop. I kept my breeding pair (of course) and that's when I found Prinny. So I've had the tree types and I have to say that I probably would have started out with a tiel...

Dani and Prinny