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Carr.birds

Ben Pic taken of '95 df indigo bronze fallow with flash. I own a son of this cock and he was paired to a Nico Theunissen blue bronze fallow. The pair gave me a blue and indigoblue bronze fallow and 2 blue/bronze fallow babies. "bronze fallow" birds don't display a similar red eye as clearh...

Carr.birds

Hi Tienie, This is what i remember from my research: There are two known sources of "bronze fallows". One is from Mr. Eyckerman in Belgium, (same source as the SA deep) and the other one is in Germany. The Belgium line was imported by South African breeder Mr Nico Theunissen in the middle ...

Carr.birds

Forum Sorry not green opaline pied but blue opaline adm pied and grey turq opaline adm pied http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/blueopalineadmpied_zpsd565edc1.jpg http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/greyturqopalineadmpied_zpsaf419df7.jpg To be opaline they must be hens,...

Carr.birds

Recio Deon named the bird a "Violino" in a joke after Babu wrote the article about the NSLino and called it a Nino. The pic of the bird was taken when still young. I think it proofed to be a cock bird and has developed a neck ring. Based on that I would say nr 1. Can anybody post a pic of ...

Carr.birds

Recio

The bird of Hans Meyer is a violet blue NSLino cleartail/???????. I bought a violet blueturq SL ino hen years ago and you could see the violet sheen on the rump and tail

Tienie

Carr.birds

I am struggling with photobucket to load pics. Will try again tomorrow

Tienie

Carr.birds

Stefan

I would go for cinnamon sl edged opaline or misty cinnamon sl edged opaline

Tienie

Carr.birds

Lee

If it is the W E.... cock I am thinking of I can confirm it is grey emerald dom pied/cleartail?

Tienie

Carr.birds

Ok, wile we wait for Madas to add about the history of the so called bronze fallow I will post some pics of these birds. Imo it is a grey/brown fallow. http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/CarrBirds9Feb2012007_zps6bd3e8a6.jpg http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/CarrBirds...

Carr.birds

Hi Stefan

You have done a lot of homework on the origin of the so called "bronze fallow. Can you please share your investigations with us.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Forum members I am questioning the existence of Bronze Fallow in IRN’s. Varies test the past few years with NSLino resulted in split birds instead of Bronze fallowNslino. I have tested “bronze fallow” birds imported form Europe with a number of SA “bronze fallow” and results proved to be the same fa...

Carr.birds

Recio

Great, thanks for the tips/advice. We will all try to make everybody feel welcome and participate.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Chris Thanks for sharing you experience and opinion with us. Forum members please give Chris an opportunity to share his point of view. Currently there is very little information available and this is the only way we can learn from a saddleback breeder. If you don’t agree with his statements and can...

Carr.birds

Gratz

My way of thinking is that emerald is a structural mutation like dark and violet (incomplete dominant) and not like indigo and turquoise allele's of the blue locus. Referring to df emerald I meant df emerald blue. What puzzles me is why nobody can account for a sf and df emerald green.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Recio, Willy, Johan, Ben and ......

I took some pics of Deon's sf and df emerald imported birds. I could tell by the naked eye that one was a sf and the other a df. I will ask Deon's permission to post the pics.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Stefan

What about an emerald df dom pied

Tienie

Carr.birds

Kees

Platinum is an allele of the sl ino locus situated between pallid and ino. Attached a dark platinum cock

Tienie

Carr.birds

Ben 1st round babies from blue opaline and SA deep green/blue http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/CarrBirds25Oct2013016_zps7d18ad4b.jpg 2nd round babies from blue opaline and SA deep green/blue hen http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/CarrBirds25Oct2013027_zpsf15a3558.jp...

Carr.birds

Johan Bred from SA deep blue sl edged/cinnamon? & violet cobalt sl edged-cinnamon hen. The 2 first round babies are cocks based on their phenotype and if not cinnamon must be split cinnamon. Do you think cobalt is involved. Second round babies are almost ready for a pic. One nice dark edged cock...

Carr.birds

Ben SA deep violet blue sl edged http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/CarrBirds20064_zpsa09978bf.jpg indigoblue cock, "brilliant" blue hen and babies http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/CarrBirds20027_zps8e6f3b3a.jpg http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/car...

Carr.birds

Willy

Thanks for the pic. I am pleased to your result. It leaves us with some opportunity to add dark without creating a phenotype similar to mauve.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Willy

Thanks for the info, much appreciated. It will safe me a year of test breeding. Please post a pic for us of violet df deep blue or violet dark df deep blue

Tienie

Carr.birds

Ben

Unlucky no dom pied or cleartail dom pied but you have confirmation in the nest that cleartail is involved with the blue cleartail baby.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Lee & Ben

The owner told me it is from a cleartail line. IMO half sider violet blue cleartail adm pied

Tienie

Carr.birds

What mutation combination is this?

I received this pic from a friend who gave permission to post it.

More pics will follow next week

Tienie

Carr.birds

shey

This is my dg sl edged cleartail/blue 2yr old cock but as mentioned not a well marked edged bird. Will post pics when I receive them from my friend.

Regards

Tienie

Carr.birds

Shey

I will post the pic again later today, but the bird is not well marked edged. A friend of mine bred some nice 2013 sl edged cleartail babies, will ask him for picture and post it.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Well done Mr T It is a pretty picture of some stunning mutation combinations. I agree with Willy but my only concern is the mixing of emerald and turq in dominant pied. Can some please post a pic of an emerald turq dom pied for comparison with emerald blue dom pied (if not an allele of blue and turq...

Carr.birds

Ben Correct. believe on looks it is the only opaline in the nest. With the naked eye at this stage I would say, " SA deep" green/blue/opaline, "SA deep" green opaline/blue and "SA deep " blue /opaline. The hen is on 4 fertile eggs for second clutch. Attached a pic from ...

Carr.birds

Wiily Thanks for sharing that with us. Attched the babies from my Blue opaline & "SA deep" green/blue (original imported hen) http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/DSC_0033_zps288a0ae5.jpg "SA deep" green mother http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/...

Carr.birds

Kees Not yet my friend, I have 2 friends that with red eye babies in the nest but we need more time to see if they are clearheaded fallow opaline. One baby look different to the other therefore I believe we have an excellent chance. We are blessed this season, all the breeders I speak to are positiv...

Carr.birds

Johan I am referring to your starting point normal/ino/opaline & normal cocks(50% of all babies) normal/ino & normal/opaline (33.5%) normal & normal/ino-opaline (16.5%) It is a different story if you start with an ino-opaline as hen. That is why I say start with an opaline hen instead of...

Carr.birds

Johan Ok, you can follow your idea. If you own /opaline/ino your are working towards one goal = ino-opaline. In Europe you will pay more for a /ino/opaline compared to /opaline. That is your choice and if breeders are honest I can't see how you can contaminate the market. I agree that some green mal...

Carr.birds

Kees I agree with what Johan suggested, but I would pair the /ino/opaline to an opaline hen. If you get an ino-opaline hen it will be a bonus, but you will get opaline cocks and hens. All the opaline cocks will be possible split ino (opaline/ino?) Take all all your opaline/ino? cocks and pair them t...

Carr.birds

Sherwin (Farzz1) Great, I believe your apology is appropriate. We are all excited, but be careful what you say. Emerald green violet proof that emerald is a structural mutation and yet Lee says the birds are to small for pics. I don't believe any breeder can achieve 100% fertility if you keep more t...

Carr.birds

Johan & Gratz No, I am not saying a saddle remain in matured birds. What I am saying it isn't just a plain turq dom pied. I don't think saddleback is the correct name. Attached see a pic of a 2012 (1 yr old) violet saddleback cock. You can clearly see the deep bright yellow (originally) limited ...

Carr.birds

Kees

We are busy with our breeding season in SA. Will mail a pic if we are lucky this year.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Ben I have bred many turq dilute & turq/dilute birds with a nice saddle in year one, after 15 month moult the turq will spread to the mantle area. Some will keep the saddle area till the 27 month moult. Attached some pics of a blueturq opaline/adm pied bred from a blueturq/opaline & adm pied...

Carr.birds

Peter Sorry I missed your question. It was from an American sf violet blue & "SA deep" blue sl edged. Nice birds you posted. Your results underline what I was saying. Nico did introduce dark into his collection, this make it very difficult to dertermine what you bred. If I can guess I ...

Carr.birds

Peter

This one is for you

sl edged blue, sl edged SA deep blue violet, sl edged violet blue & SA deep blue

Tienie

Carr.birds

Peter

If you can add a sf "SA deep" blue it will help.

blue, sf & df "SA deep" blue, cobalt and violet blue

Tienie

Carr.birds

Lee I have posted this pic before. She has a nice dark brighter phenotype compared to Dark) She is paired to a Blue Opaline cock. 3 Babies hatched last week. L to R (Normal, Dark, Violet and bottom "SA deep") http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/GreenDgreenSADeepgreenampViole...

Carr.birds

Robert & Peter Peter the original imported birds were 2 females (yr 2000). They were imported as "European darkgreen/turq & cobalt turq. Stefan traced the information for back to Luc van de Kerckhove. It is difficult to believe the green bird posted is a df SA deep. Attached find a pic ...

Carr.birds

Stefan You have labeled them correctly. The pic was taken on the 8th of May 2013. The df violet blue is a proven imported American cock. I will take pics this weekend of 2012 birds for comparison American df violet blue, American sf violet cobalt, American sf violet blue and American sf violet "...

Carr.birds

Robert & Willy Robert sorry to disappoint you but I bought all my "SA deep"birds from NT in January 2012. This is only my second breeding season with them. As mentioned before I am not prepared to make statements before I have sorted them out myself. It will take some time because I am...

Carr.birds

Petrus

Send the pics of the SL edged blue opaline and blueturq dilute opaline to me I will post them for you.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Ben & Robert

Ben you are spot on, no edged just "bronze fallow". IMO dun or pale fallow. Pretty birds but difficult breeders unlike the SA line that reproduce at 2 years.

Tienie

Carr.birds

Willy We have been working very hard in SA to sort out the Bronze Fallow issue. This issue was discussed many a time between Recio, Stefan, Johan and myself. When Sjack visited SA 5 years ago he told most of us that our Bronze Fallow birds are to light in phenotype compared to his. I then decided to...

Carr.birds

Gratz I think your cock is a violet green. Attach a pic I received in 2008 From Deon Smith violet green vs violet darkgreen http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/VioletgreenandViioletDarkFgreen2_zps7f842576.jpg violet darkgreen http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y403/carrbirds/CarrBird...

Carr.birds

Procrastinator According to my knowledge no export quarantine facility exit in OZ. Breeders/exporters must put bird in Quarantine in a separate aviary and like all other Countries perform certain test required by our Government under supervision of their local State Vet. Unfortunately pbfdv isn't pa...

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